All Blacks: Ian Foster on keeping his job as coach – ‘Leading Under Pressure’ book extract

I suspect there will always be different accounts of what exactly happened in the hours after we won at Ellis Park, and whether I was going to be fired on the Sunday morning if not for a late change of heart. Only Robbo [Mark Robinson, New Zealand Rugby CEO] and the board know the answer to that. All I know is my version of events, which began when Sam Cane and Ardie Savea bailed me up in the tunnel as I was making my way to the press conference.

“Right, everything is all sorted now,” Sam said.

“What do you mean by that?” I replied.

“You’re not going to resign now,” he said firmly.

I was surprised that he thought that had been an option, because I’d never said anything to anyone about resigning. I didn’t ask where they’d got that idea from, but it seemed they felt that would be my solution.

But now they said it wasn’t an option: that they had put everything on the line to win, and they were urging me to think again.

Ian Foster celebrates with Ardie Savea after beating South Africa at Ellis Park in 2022. Photo / Photosport

“I have no idea what the future holds or whether I’m going to be the All Blacks coach tomorrow,” I told Sam and Ardie, “but I promise you one thing: I won’t be resigning.”

That was where I left it, but they said: “We’re going to do something about this.”

I didn’t think they had any cards to play and assured them they’d done everything they could already.

“You’ve done everything you can do by winning,” I replied. “It’s in the CEO’s hands now.”

I didn’t direct them or encourage them, but they said they wanted to talk to Robbo. All I said was: “That’s your choice. This is not my game anymore. I’ve done what I have to do, and now it is everyone else’s choices.”

When I got back to the hotel, I found out that the All Blacks leaders had decided to call a meeting with the CEO. They didn’t tell me directly that they were doing that, and the whole time I was All Blacks coach, I never knew what was said at that meeting, because I never asked.

Ian Foster facing the media as All Blacks coach. Photo / NZME

That evening, there was a rooftop barbecue held for the team at the hotel, and when Robbo came back after he had finished that meeting, he sat down near me and tried to chat normally. That was good. I was pleased he was there and enjoying the moment, but the respect I’d had for him previously had changed. It was a hard relationship for me to figure out how to be because I felt there were so many things happening around me and behind me. There was not a lot of trust between us anymore. In fact, I would even say there was zero trust.

I went to bed feeling satisfied with what we’d achieved that day. As I was about to turn out the light, my phone lit up with a message from Robbo asking if I was available for a chat. I knew he was going to do a media conference the next day and what he wanted to do was say he’d spoken to me before he announced whatever he planned to say the next morning. I didn’t want to ruin my night, so I turned my phone off.

The next morning, I started packing and reviewing the game. Matt [Manukia, All Blacks communications manager] came up and told me Robbo was going ahead with his media conference, and that I would do mine an hour and a half later. Matt asked what I was going to say, and I said I’d just talk about the game.

“What about your future?” Matt asked, but I said I didn’t know.

Matt told me everyone was talking about what I’d said to Jeff Wilson after the match, which I took to mean that NZR [New Zealand Rugby] weren’t happy about it. But I’d just been honest. I told Matt to come and find me after the CEO’s press conference so he could tell me how it went.

All Blacks coach Ian Foster (centre) talks with Sky Sport presenters and former All Blacks Jeff Wilson (left) and Ma'a Nonu. Photo / Photosport

A little while later, Matt reported back to me and said, his words, “It was a disaster.”

He said that Robbo had said nothing and had looked scruffy. The media were spewing, wanting to know why the CEO had called a conference if he had nothing to say. Robbo’s basic message had been that he was going home and would talk to his board about my future.

Like I say, only Robbo will know the answer, but I think we forced NZR into changing their plan – or at least we put enough pressure on them that they were no longer willing to commit to definitive action until they had reconvened and talked it over.

After Robbo had finished with the media, he texted me to ask if we could have a coffee. I said yes, but was quite specific that we would meet in the foyer of the hotel, where everyone would be able to see us. I didn’t want to be tucked away in a secluded corner for this conversation.

I asked him how his conference had gone and he said okay, and then straight off the bat he told me that all the leaks to the media had to stop. I had no idea to what leaks he was referring to.

“Why are you talking to me about that?” I asked. He doubled down: “There is too much stuff coming out and we have got to stop it.”

“Do you think I am doing that?” I said in disbelief.

“Well, if it’s not you, it’s people around you, or people you can control.”

Leading Under Pressure, by Ian Foster.

It felt like we were going well off-piste, but as he’d brought it up and seemed keen to talk about, I decided to make a few things clear. “Robbo, I haven’t got a media strategy to undermine you or to leak anything,” I said firmly. “It doesn’t serve my interests when the team is leaked and all that sort of stuff. I don’t know why you’re saying it’s me or someone in my set-up. By the way, have you looked over your shoulder at your own board?”

Robbo told me that he thought he had his board under control and that no one was leaking from inside the organisation.

Whatever the point of this exchange had been, I felt it needed to end. “Why don’t we agree that you’ll look over your shoulder at your board and I’ll look over my shoulder at my group?” I said.

I think we were having this odd exchange about media leaks because Robbo had nothing else to say to me. He certainly didn’t have any clarity about my future. All he told me was that he had to go back to New Zealand and talk to the board, and that he’d be in touch early next week.

It was all so wishy-washy. Nothing like we think you have a job or don’t have a job. It was nothing like that ... just, we will have a chat next week. He was stuck in no man’s land – not prepared to fire me but also not prepared to give me any assurances about my job.

Robbo knew he had to be careful in what he said, because he’d been getting in contact with Razor [Scott Robertson] back in New Zealand that week – and he must have suspected that I knew about it. He had been bailed up by All Blacks leaders, and we’d just beaten the Springboks. And now the head coach was sitting across from him and saying he didn’t know whether he still had his job or not. I just don’t think, sitting there in the atrium of the Sandton Sun Hotel that day, Robbo had any idea what his next move should be.

I did my media conference shortly after my coffee with Robbo and basically repeated everything I’d said the night before. Inevitably, the questions came about the answer I had given [Jeff Wilson, Sky presenter and former All Black] and I said, ‘Look, the reality is that’s not my decision. But am I going home preparing to play Argentina? Yes, I am. Am I 100% sure about things? No, I am not.’

***

I arrived home on the afternoon of Monday, 17 August and was straight on the phone to Joe Schmidt. I needed to see if I could persuade him to change his role from analyst and selector to attack coach.

“I’m assuming, for the moment, that I still have the job,” I told him. “I enjoyed doing the attack and it was the right thing for the guys to hear me a lot more in South Africa. I think I could do it for the rest of the Rugby Championship.”

But I suggested to Joe that he should have a talk with his wife, Kelly, and consider joining the team on the end-of-year tour so he could help me with the attack.

Joe told me he’d already spoken to Kelly and he was ready to start work next week. Robbo and Lendo [NZR general manager, professional rugby and performance Chris Lendrum] were back at my house the next day with some news. The NZR board had decided to stick with me as coach and was backing me through to the 2023 World Cup.

Our conversation was matter-of-fact, perfunctory, but that was fine with me. I told them that Joe was going to join us as an assistant coach, and they were pleased with that.

I would be very surprised if Robbo hadn’t spoken to Joe about this beforehand at some point, because they’d already been speaking to him about Razor. So I don’t know how surprised they were by my news, but I felt it was clearly the right thing for the team.

The next day, I went up to Auckland and did a media conference with Robbo and the NZR chair, Stewart Mitchell, who both said they were backing me 100% to the Rugby World Cup.

All Blacks head coach Ian Foster (left) and New Zealand Rugby CEO Mark Robinson at the press conference to announce Foster's retention. Photo / Photosport

What I found most interesting about this whole period was that Robbo had let the media define his strategy. I never felt that he or the NZR board had a clear strategy of their own.

They were constantly coming up with ad-hoc plans. Within the All Blacks, we had a defined strategy that was guided by a simple principle of always doing the right thing for the team. I don’t think Robbo ever understood that, and it was becoming almost impossible to function effectively because of the lack of alignment and unity.

Edited extract from Leading Under Pressure by Ian Foster with Gregor Paul, on sale June 18, $39.99 RRP (HarperCollins Publishers)