NZ Herald
  • Home
  • Latest news
  • Herald NOW
  • Video
  • New Zealand
  • Sport
  • World
  • Business
  • Entertainment
  • Podcasts
  • Quizzes
  • Opinion
  • Lifestyle
  • Travel
  • Viva
  • Weather

Subscriptions

  • Herald Premium
  • Viva Premium
  • The Listener
  • BusinessDesk

Sections

  • Latest news
  • New Zealand
    • All New Zealand
    • Crime
    • Politics
    • Education
    • Open Justice
    • Scam Update
  • Herald NOW
  • On The Up
  • World
    • All World
    • Australia
    • Asia
    • UK
    • United States
    • Middle East
    • Europe
    • Pacific
  • Business
    • All Business
    • MarketsSharesCurrencyCommoditiesStock TakesCrypto
    • Markets with Madison
    • Media Insider
    • Business analysis
    • Personal financeKiwiSaverInterest ratesTaxInvestment
    • EconomyInflationGDPOfficial cash rateEmployment
    • Small business
    • Business reportsMood of the BoardroomProject AucklandSustainable business and financeCapital markets reportAgribusiness reportInfrastructure reportDynamic business
    • Deloitte Top 200 Awards
    • CompaniesAged CareAgribusinessAirlinesBanking and financeConstructionEnergyFreight and logisticsHealthcareManufacturingMedia and MarketingRetailTelecommunicationsTourism
  • Opinion
    • All Opinion
    • Analysis
    • Editorials
    • Business analysis
    • Premium opinion
    • Letters to the editor
  • Politics
  • Sport
    • All Sport
    • OlympicsParalympics
    • RugbySuper RugbyNPCAll BlacksBlack FernsRugby sevensSchool rugby
    • CricketBlack CapsWhite Ferns
    • Racing
    • NetballSilver Ferns
    • LeagueWarriorsNRL
    • FootballWellington PhoenixAuckland FCAll WhitesFootball FernsEnglish Premier League
    • GolfNZ Open
    • MotorsportFormula 1
    • Boxing
    • UFC
    • BasketballNBABreakersTall BlacksTall Ferns
    • Tennis
    • Cycling
    • Athletics
    • SailingAmerica's CupSailGP
    • Rowing
  • Lifestyle
    • All Lifestyle
    • Viva - Food, fashion & beauty
    • Society Insider
    • Royals
    • Sex & relationships
    • Food & drinkRecipesRecipe collectionsRestaurant reviewsRestaurant bookings
    • Health & wellbeing
    • Fashion & beauty
    • Pets & animals
    • The Selection - Shop the trendsShop fashionShop beautyShop entertainmentShop giftsShop home & living
    • Milford's Investing Place
  • Entertainment
    • All Entertainment
    • TV
    • MoviesMovie reviews
    • MusicMusic reviews
    • BooksBook reviews
    • Culture
    • ReviewsBook reviewsMovie reviewsMusic reviewsRestaurant reviews
  • Travel
    • All Travel
    • News
    • New ZealandNorthlandAucklandWellingtonCanterburyOtago / QueenstownNelson-TasmanBest NZ beaches
    • International travelAustraliaPacific IslandsEuropeUKUSAAfricaAsia
    • Rail holidays
    • Cruise holidays
    • Ski holidays
    • Luxury travel
    • Adventure travel
  • Kāhu Māori news
  • Environment
    • All Environment
    • Our Green Future
  • Talanoa Pacific news
  • Property
    • All Property
    • Property Insider
    • Interest rates tracker
    • Residential property listings
    • Commercial property listings
  • Health
  • Technology
    • All Technology
    • AI
    • Social media
  • Rural
    • All Rural
    • Dairy farming
    • Sheep & beef farming
    • Horticulture
    • Animal health
    • Rural business
    • Rural life
    • Rural technology
    • Opinion
    • Audio & podcasts
  • Weather forecasts
    • All Weather forecasts
    • Kaitaia
    • Whangārei
    • Dargaville
    • Auckland
    • Thames
    • Tauranga
    • Hamilton
    • Whakatāne
    • Rotorua
    • Tokoroa
    • Te Kuiti
    • Taumaranui
    • Taupō
    • Gisborne
    • New Plymouth
    • Napier
    • Hastings
    • Dannevirke
    • Whanganui
    • Palmerston North
    • Levin
    • Paraparaumu
    • Masterton
    • Wellington
    • Motueka
    • Nelson
    • Blenheim
    • Westport
    • Reefton
    • Kaikōura
    • Greymouth
    • Hokitika
    • Christchurch
    • Ashburton
    • Timaru
    • Wānaka
    • Oamaru
    • Queenstown
    • Dunedin
    • Gore
    • Invercargill
  • Meet the journalists
  • Promotions & competitions
  • OneRoof property listings
  • Driven car news

Puzzles & Quizzes

  • Puzzles
    • All Puzzles
    • Sudoku
    • Code Cracker
    • Crosswords
    • Cryptic crossword
    • Wordsearch
  • Quizzes
    • All Quizzes
    • Morning quiz
    • Afternoon quiz
    • Sports quiz

Regions

  • Northland
    • All Northland
    • Far North
    • Kaitaia
    • Kerikeri
    • Kaikohe
    • Bay of Islands
    • Whangarei
    • Dargaville
    • Kaipara
    • Mangawhai
  • Auckland
  • Waikato
    • All Waikato
    • Hamilton
    • Coromandel & Hauraki
    • Matamata & Piako
    • Cambridge
    • Te Awamutu
    • Tokoroa & South Waikato
    • Taupō & Tūrangi
  • Bay of Plenty
    • All Bay of Plenty
    • Katikati
    • Tauranga
    • Mount Maunganui
    • Pāpāmoa
    • Te Puke
    • Whakatāne
  • Rotorua
  • Hawke's Bay
    • All Hawke's Bay
    • Napier
    • Hastings
    • Havelock North
    • Central Hawke's Bay
    • Wairoa
  • Taranaki
    • All Taranaki
    • Stratford
    • New Plymouth
    • Hāwera
  • Manawatū - Whanganui
    • All Manawatū - Whanganui
    • Whanganui
    • Palmerston North
    • Manawatū
    • Tararua
    • Horowhenua
  • Wellington
    • All Wellington
    • Kapiti
    • Wairarapa
    • Upper Hutt
    • Lower Hutt
  • Nelson & Tasman
    • All Nelson & Tasman
    • Motueka
    • Nelson
    • Tasman
  • Marlborough
  • West Coast
  • Canterbury
    • All Canterbury
    • Kaikōura
    • Christchurch
    • Ashburton
    • Timaru
  • Otago
    • All Otago
    • Oamaru
    • Dunedin
    • Balclutha
    • Alexandra
    • Queenstown
    • Wanaka
  • Southland
    • All Southland
    • Invercargill
    • Gore
    • Stewart Island
  • Gisborne

Media

  • Video
    • All Video
    • NZ news video
    • Herald NOW
    • Business news video
    • Politics news video
    • Sport video
    • World news video
    • Lifestyle video
    • Entertainment video
    • Travel video
    • Markets with Madison
    • Kea Kids news
  • Podcasts
    • All Podcasts
    • The Front Page
    • On the Tiles
    • Ask me Anything
    • The Little Things
  • Cartoons
  • Photo galleries
  • Today's Paper - E-editions
  • Photo sales
  • Classifieds

NZME Network

  • Advertise with NZME
  • OneRoof
  • Driven Car Guide
  • BusinessDesk
  • Newstalk ZB
  • Sunlive
  • ZM
  • The Hits
  • Coast
  • Radio Hauraki
  • The Alternative Commentary Collective
  • Gold
  • Flava
  • iHeart Radio
  • Hokonui
  • Radio Wanaka
  • iHeartCountry New Zealand
  • Restaurant Hub
  • NZME Events

SubscribeSign In
Advertisement
Advertise with NZME.
Home / New Zealand

Date rape should mean court date

By Catherine Masters
Property Journalist·NZ Herald·
5 Sep, 2008 04:00 PM6 mins to read

Subscribe to listen

Access to Herald Premium articles require a Premium subscription. Subscribe now to listen.
Already a subscriber?  Sign in here

Listening to articles is free for open-access content—explore other articles or learn more about text-to-speech.
‌
Save

    Share this article

Parts of an interview with Dame Helen Mirren were pre-released on the internet, causing worldwide indignation. Photo / Supplied

Parts of an interview with Dame Helen Mirren were pre-released on the internet, causing worldwide indignation. Photo / Supplied

KEY POINTS:

Satirical UK website The Daily Mash puts it this way: "Dame Helen Mirren last night threw up all over a coffee table and then urged everyone to have a good look at it."

The Oscar-winning actress, according to the spoof write-up, then picked through the contents of her
stomach, drawing attention to a light lunch of pasta with mushrooms, as well as a medium-sized Scotch egg that had clearly been swallowed whole.

Not a bad summary of what no doubt is a harrowing time for outspoken Mirren, who let loose in a magazine interview about her former cocaine snorting and in which she also made some dubious and controversial comments about date rape.

Mirren came under a frenzy of criticism in Britain - Guardian commentator Julie Bindel described Mirren's logic as twisted - and the story is still reverberating around the world.

The published comments are actually some of the juicier bits taken from a yet to be published full interview with GQ magazine. Mirren has apparently issued a statement saying while she does not dispute their accuracy, she does ask people to read the article in its entirety before drawing conclusions.

If people do so their conclusions will likely be "far less sweeping and sensational than those drawn by some in the popular press. She does not wish to qualify any of her remarks, she just wants to avoid having them presented in inflammatory language," said a spokesman.

Too late for the Dame, really, given her comments have already whizzed around the world via the internet.

This is what she is reported to have said: "I was date-raped, yes. A couple of times. Not with excessive violence, but rather being locked in a room and made to have sex against my will.

"If a woman voluntarily ends up in man's bedroom with her clothes off ... it's such a tricky area, isn't it? Especially if there is no violence.

"I think she has the right to say no at the last second. But I don't think she can have that man in court under those circumstances. I guess it is one of the many subtle parts of the men/women relationship that has to be negotiated and worked out between them.

"I was polite and didn't have the courage to say that to men who wouldn't accept 'no' for an answer. I was very innocent when I went to college in London. I went to a convent school and had never spent a night away from home or gone to parties or any of that."

Though some of the responses around the world have hardly been measured, Kathryn McPhillips, from the Auckland Sexual Abuse Foundation, was. She said that while it's a bit hard commenting on half an interview, some of what Mirren said seemed to make good sense. But some of it didn't.

"The way I read it was she said that if you choose to go back to a man's bedroom and engage in kissing and cuddling but you say no to intercourse that's okay, that no should stand and that it's rape if someone proceeds to intercourse when you've said no.

"So we totally agree with that. It was just the next bit I think when she said that that kind of situation shouldn't end up in court or doesn't end up in court."

The reality is, the kind of date rape Mirren describes doesn't get to court - but it should because when the woman says no and the man continues, this is rape and he is breaking the law.

But Mirren's attitude is not out of sync for a woman of her generation, says McPhillips. And she doesn't think Mirren's comments have put the rape issue back decades, as some in Britain have suggested.

Our Government has set up a Taskforce for Action on Sexual Violence and McPhillips is hopeful the rape law will be changed to include a clear definition around consent.

Because no means no, she says.

The law already states if a woman is so drunk a man cannot get consent from her but has sex with her anyway, that is rape. But the law does not contain the man having to prove consent.

"What happens at the moment is the reasonable belief defence, so if a guy can go into court and say 'well, I thought she wanted it' at the moment it's automatic, so he doesn't have to have any proof that he did anything to check that out."

Mirren's comments have incited anger in others in New Zealand.

Deborah Joy, of the Courageous Women Charitable Trust, says it is these kinds of comments which lead women not to report date rape.

"In New Zealand up to 90 per cent of rape and sexual abuse goes unreported. We need to see more women reporting such instances to police and a few stiff sentences being handed down by the courts to change attitudes."

There are those, however, who applaud Mirren's comments.

A male Herald Online reader had this to say: "To get to the final gate, so to speak, and say no, please, come on.

"A male libido is not something that can simply be turned off like a water tap. It would be 'nice' to think life works like that but you are dealing with a human being here. It is all fine and well to hold the high ground that No is No! However, when alcohol or drugs are involved, common sense flies out the window. Reality!"

McPhillips says she would remind that reader that he has a cortex and frontal lobes, thus the capacity to think and thinking can override other neural systems at play here.

"We want to hit someone, we don't go round and just do it. There are many, many physical processes that feel strong and automatic that we are able to override and that's the difference with human beings."

As for the alcohol factor, if the man uses his brain and decides to get drunk, then date rapes, he is responsible for that decision. "The same as if you drive drunk and kill someone."

Advertisement
Advertise with NZME.
Advertisement
Advertise with NZME.
Save

    Share this article

Latest from New Zealand

Crime

Man, 23, turns himself in after Auckland market stabbing

22 Jun 08:53 AM
Crime

'Naughty' parolee holding woman at gunpoint left after telling off from toddler

22 Jun 08:00 AM
New Zealand

New Zealander arrested in France charged with attempted murder of political activist

22 Jun 06:37 AM

Help for those helping hardest-hit

sponsored
Advertisement
Advertise with NZME.

Latest from New Zealand

Man, 23, turns himself in after Auckland market stabbing

Man, 23, turns himself in after Auckland market stabbing

22 Jun 08:53 AM

He faces two charges of wounding with intent to cause grievous bodily harm.

'Naughty' parolee holding woman at gunpoint left after telling off from toddler

'Naughty' parolee holding woman at gunpoint left after telling off from toddler

22 Jun 08:00 AM
New Zealander arrested in France charged with attempted murder of political activist

New Zealander arrested in France charged with attempted murder of political activist

22 Jun 06:37 AM
Two critically injured after multi-vehicle crash on key Auckland road

Two critically injured after multi-vehicle crash on key Auckland road

22 Jun 05:50 AM
How a Timaru mum of three budding chefs stretched her grocery shop
sponsored

How a Timaru mum of three budding chefs stretched her grocery shop

NZ Herald
  • About NZ Herald
  • Meet the journalists
  • Newsletters
  • Classifieds
  • Help & support
  • Contact us
  • House rules
  • Privacy Policy
  • Terms of use
  • Competition terms & conditions
  • Our use of AI
Subscriber Services
  • NZ Herald e-editions
  • Daily puzzles & quizzes
  • Manage your digital subscription
  • Manage your print subscription
  • Subscribe to the NZ Herald newspaper
  • Subscribe to Herald Premium
  • Gift a subscription
  • Subscriber FAQs
  • Subscription terms & conditions
  • Promotions and subscriber benefits
NZME Network
  • The New Zealand Herald
  • The Northland Age
  • The Northern Advocate
  • Waikato Herald
  • Bay of Plenty Times
  • Rotorua Daily Post
  • Hawke's Bay Today
  • Whanganui Chronicle
  • Viva
  • NZ Listener
  • Newstalk ZB
  • BusinessDesk
  • OneRoof
  • Driven Car Guide
  • iHeart Radio
  • Restaurant Hub
NZME
  • About NZME
  • NZME careers
  • Advertise with NZME
  • Digital self-service advertising
  • Book your classified ad
  • Photo sales
  • NZME Events
  • © Copyright 2025 NZME Publishing Limited
TOP