Former All Black Carlos Spencer. Photo / Jason Oxenham
Former All Blacks rugby star Carlos Spencer talks about returning home to New Zealand to coach the Hurricanes and update his iconic Toffee Pops advert.
1 Your family has returned to New Zealand after 18 years overseas. Why are you living in Hamilton?
My wife Jo and I had wanted to come home for a while and get our kids settled. Auckland had too much traffic. Hamilton's close and has good schools so we ended up building a home here a couple of years ago. My parents have moved in with us so they can help Jo with the kids while I'm away coaching in Japan. I'm away seven to eight months of the year which gets pretty lonely.
2 Will you move to Wellington in December when you take up your new job as assistant coach of the Hurricanes?
We were keen to relocate but we're putting our kids first. They've been moved around a lot over the years and it takes a toll, especially as they get older. Payton was a year old when we left New Zealand and Ashley was born in Northampton so they've grown up in the UK and South Africa. They're 14 and 10 now and have settled into life here. I'll just commute to Wellington.
3 Why did you take the job coaching in Japan?
The club I was coaching at in South Africa, Port Elizabeth, was broke and I was owed a bit of money. It was a stressful time. Obviously you have to go where the jobs are. I tried to get back to New Zealand a couple of times, to get a job with the Blues, but that didn't happen. When a job came up in Japan I couldn't turn it down. The money was good and I needed work.
4 You made your name in the Auckland Blues. Won't it be weird coaching Wellington?
No because I'm from down that way. I grew up in Levin and always hoped to play for Wellington. Dad worked as a drain layer in Wellington for many years and I'd help him out in the school holidays. I'm still passionate about the Blues. My ambition was always to come back and coach the Blues one day but if there was another New Zealand team I'd coach it would be Wellington or even the Chiefs.
5 The Blues have never been as good since you left. Do you know why?
Yeah they haven't and that's been disappointing for me and a lot of ex-players and fans. Everyone's got their ideas on what's wrong but it's not for me to say. Unless you're actually in that environment and with them every day, you don't know.
6 Growing up in Levin, what did you want to be when you grew up?
I didn't have a clue. I didn't enjoy school. I wasn't naughty, I just always looked forward to lunch time and getting out with the boys playing bullrush. Softball was my favourite sport. I almost gave up rugby for softball at 16 but for some reason I decided to stick with rugby.
7 How did you meet your wife Jo?
We met in high school through sport. Jo played rep netball in the Manawatu and I used to go out with her friend. We grew up on different sides of the railway tracks. We bumped into each other after a test match in Hamilton in 1997 and had a bit of a chat, then got together a couple of years later. Jo's been a huge support. She made sacrifices in her teaching career so I can do the job I love.
8 How did the original Toffee Pops ad come about in 1999?
Back then I had agents. I think DOJ (David Jones) approached me. I knew I'd have to walk downstairs in a robe. I was a bit uncertain, but I came around and thought, "I'll give it a go" and the rest is history. Even now I have women coming up to me asking if I've got a Toffee Pop. I got a lot of crap from my rugby mates. The worst thing was they put a huge poster of me on the side of a building at Sky City and every time we pulled in on the bus there would be a bit of banter. Greg Dyer contacted me about doing the new ad. As soon as I found out it was fully clothed, I said "Yeah I'll do it". Coming back to New Zealand, Greg and I thought it might be good to get back in the public eye.
9 When you left in 2005, was it nice to be away from New Zealand?
Yeah it was. Being a rugby player in New Zealand, you're always in the public eye. The pressure is huge and if you're not on your game or you put one foot wrong it's like the whole world's on top of you. That's part of the challenge and what motivates you to do even better but once we got to the UK that pressure was gone. Their newspapers might have half a page of rugby then 15 pages of football. South Africa's not big on filling their newspapers with sport either.
10 What have been some tough patches in your career and how have you got through them?
I had a bad injury in the first week of the 1999 Rugby World Cup which put me out of the whole World Cup. That was tough. I knew I'd play again but it was never really 100 per cent. Losing to Australia in the World Cup semifinal in 2003 was another devastating moment, and getting dropped from the ABs in 2002 by John Mitchell. I didn't think much of Mitch back in 2002 but we're pretty good friends now. He gave me the best start in coaching.
11 What is the "X Factor" that distinguishes a good coach from a great one?
Building the right team culture. Most teams have got Samoans, Tongans, Fijians, Maori — trying to bring all those cultures together as one is challenging. Creating an atmosphere where people enjoy turning out for work every day; doing the same thing day in and day out can become arduous. Earning the trust of the players, having that player coach relationship is crucial. If I see a player struggling with something I'll always go up and try to find out what's wrong and if they want to open up.
12 Did you ever have a coach that you've opened up to?
No. I've always dealt with stuff like that on my own. I've been quite lucky in that I never got myself into trouble off the pitch. My issues were form-related. It's not that I haven't wanted to ask for advice but I've always been quite shy, so for me to approach someone and have a conversation like that I found quite awkward. Graham Henry? I loved Ted — he was my best coach but rugby was different in amateur days. I worked fulltime as a courier. Training was on Tuesdays and Thursdays, so we didn't spend a lot of time together. Rugby's professional from high school now. Boys are picked up on scholarships at 14 and 15 so the culture's embedded from an early age.
Bonus question: How do you feel about your 14-year-old son playing rugby in the professional era?
I see what some of these kids are given and I just think they're getting spoilt. They've got to earn it, especially at that age. That's the way I was raised and how Jo and I are with our kids now. It's about respect and discipline. If you want something in life you've got to work for it. Nothing's a given.
Where will Saturday's final eventually rank amongst the annals?