KEY POINTS:
They played together at club and international level but Ricki Herbert admits he and Brian Turner were not particularly close, socially at least, in the years after the 1982 World Cup.
"There is," Herbert points out, "a considerable age difference."
But when Herbert, 46, was appointed to coach
the under-23 Olympic team in 2004, he had no hesitation in turning to the "old trooper", inviting him to be his assistant.
"I wanted someone who had been in and understood the All Whites environment," said Herbert. "Brian was exactly what I was looking for." Turner, as Herbert's lieutenant, is charged with "player relationships".
"Brian has always had a good understanding of players. He sets standards we both want," said Herbert. "He is a proud person in that environment."
Says Turner, 56: "Absolutely, I'm happy to wear the assistant's hat. There is a lot of trust and transparency between us."
Asked to define his role, Turner says he is the "gofer" between Herbert and the players.
Turner, one of only two players to play more than 100 times for New Zealand, feels frustrated when "players make themselves unavailable".
He also struggles to understand the stance taken by [recently-retired] Noah Hickey and Che Bunce.
"From day one we placed a lot of emphasis on the senior players and the role they were expected to take. Like the All Blacks, we set standards and protocols. They were part of that.
"I now find it hard to understand why they have said some of the things they have and are questioning Ricki's ability to work with the All Whites and the Phoenix."
It was only Turner's commitment to his marketing manager's role with National Starch and Chemicals - a company he joined just before the 1982 World Cup finals in Spain - that stopped him joining Herbert at the Phoenix.
"It was something I thought long and hard about," Turner admitted. "But in the end I had to say no and wish Ricki all the best."
It will, however, mean Turner has a deeper involvement with the national side. Something he looks forward to.
* Herbert said he expects Richard Johnson, now cleared to play after having an initial jail sentence revoked following a drunk-driving conviction in Australia, to be among the 13 (of 17) players at Phoenix training on Monday. Herbert is continuing talks with Shane Smeltz, the All Whites' two-goal hero against Wales.