3 Why did surfers clash with surf lifesavers?
There was a natural clash between the two groups because one was a team sport and the other was individual. At first they had to play nice because surfboards were so heavy you had to store them at the surf club and drag them down to the water and back. In the 1960s they got shorter, lighter boards which could be carried on cars. Surfers were known for their bad behaviour. They were seen as people who "dropped out" long before the hippies. Whereas the culture of lifesaving had got very controlled with some quite ridiculous procedures. By the 60s the lifesavers looked like a tired old police force and the sport went into crisis. Bob Harvey was highly influential in helping them modernise.
4 Is the Kiwi bach largely a myth of popular imagination?
This idea that all Kiwis had a bach is largely a construction of the 1980s. In fact only about 5 per cent of New Zealanders were bach owners and 10 per cent had access. Maybe most of the children who grew up with baches went into advertising. Rob Muldoon had the standard rustic bach at Hatfields Beach but by the end of the 70s no one wanted the standard rustic bach anymore. You started getting beachfront subdivisions, places like Pauanui. Most of us went on holiday to camping grounds and caravan parks. The men went back to work after two weeks and just came back on weekends so kids grew up in this eternal summer with no authoritarian presence.
5 Were you a beach-goer growing up?
Yes, I grew up in Beach Haven, Auckland, in a house that went right down to the beachfront. It was a grotty little beach but a fantastic place to grow up.
6 Have you always been fascinated by historical objects?
Yes, I've been collecting since I was small. My partner Peter (Wells) says I'm like a heat-seeking missile in an op shop. Growing up I had two or three sets of very old neighbours who I loved hanging out with after school, going through boxes and looking at old pictures. One woman who was very influential in my growing up was Shirley Barton. She'd been in China with Rewi Alley in the 40s and had a big chest full of Chinese antiques. She taught me from age 5 how to handle and care for objects. But at the same time I'm not sentimental about objects once I've studied them. I've given a lot of stuff to museums.
7 How did you become director of the Hawke's Bay Museum and Art Gallery in 2006?
I originally trained as a furniture designer and worked for Morgan Brothers, the home of Lay-Z Boy. Then I became an academic and wrote columns and books on design and architecture. I began curating exhibitions for art galleries and museums in 1991 and had worked on many projects with the Hawke's Bay Museum when they invited me to apply for the job.
8 You led the institution's controversial transformation into the MTG Hawke's Bay. What went wrong?
The biggest challenge I had was Napier was the only council in the country to charge its ratepayers to visit their own museum. How could I compete with a $30 million movie for an afternoon's entertainment with the kids? Another part of the problem was that I lost a very supportive female mayor and chief executive. Blokes want to see museums full of ploughs and wagon wheels. 9 What are you most proud of in your eight years in Hawke's Bay?The behind-the-scenes work we did developing and caring for New Zealand's oldest and largest regional collection. One of our coups was the exhibition Travel in Style with Whetu Tirikatene-Sullivan. She was probably New Zealand's first fashion icon. We worked with her for 10 years to ensure her wardrobe came to us.
10 On returning to Auckland you joined the city's public art panel. Are there any commissions you're proud of?
The Michael Parekowhai house on Queens Wharf opening in February is going to be fabulous. Some of the public will hate it and a less vocal part will go, "Hey - that's way cool!" which is what you want with big public art works. You don't need to go into some deep contemplative state. Wellington's got this crazy inflated sense of self confidence it doesn't deserve. I'd like to see Auckland loved a bit more - it's a sexy, warm city - and public art is a way of really loving your city. People complain about spending a million dollars on an art project. We should be doing $10 million art projects, the sorts of things people cross the world to see.
11Have you planned to write this book for a while?
When I wrote my book on New Zealand design, At Home, I'd always wanted to pair it with a book called At Work and Play so when I was commissioned by Penguin to write this it was perfect because I already had a wealth of research. Everyone imagines researching a beach book means going to a lot of beaches. It actually means sitting in a lot of libraries.
12 Do you pose any controversial theories in your new book?
Oh, I hope so. A Dunedin academic told me he loved the way I went up against James Belich with total confidence which was funny because I didn't know I had. I'm proud that this is the first history of a mainstream topic in New Zealand told from a self-consciously queer point of view. I talk about notions of desire. We go to the beach to look at people. Some are looking at the boys and some at the girls. It's quite a wicked book in a way. New Zealanders are not very good at talking about pleasure and that's what the beach was for - perving at people and having fun.
• Beach Life: A Celebration of Kiwi Beach Culture, Douglas Lloyd Jenkins, Penguin, RRP $60
