MYOB and NZME have partnered to bring you a special head-to-head debate between Grant Robertson (Minister for Finance, Labour Party) and Nicola Willis (Deputy Leader and Spokesperson for Finance and Social Investment, National Party) moderated by the New Zealand Herald’s Liam Dann.
Finance Minister Grant Robertson is continuing to pledge to take a “balanced” approach towards managing the economy, while his National Party counterpart, Nicola Willis, is vying to be more “predictable” in the way she sets policy.
The pair clashed in a MYOB-NZME organised debate, focused on small businesses, on Tuesdaymorning.
They made similar noises to each other around the need to dampen inflation, improve productivity, and focus on education and training.
Neither Robertson nor Willis committed to putting a number on how many migrants they wanted to see come to New Zealand. They wanted settings to remain flexible.
Willis pledged to listen to business owners, and not “demonise” them, pit them against their employees, or cast them as the “bad guys” in the economy.
“We must provide you with a predictable and responsive environment, resist additional red tape and regulation… knowing that cumulatively those changes can erode your confidence,” she told the business audience.
Meanwhile, Robertson said the country “turned a corner” on immigration, the Government had introduced a new offence to deter ram raiders and had progressed seven new or upgraded free trade agreements.
“I understand it is a tough environment, which is why you need certainty and stability,” he assured.
The pair’s differences were highlighted as they discussed how they would plug the country’s infrastructure deficit.
At a high level, Robertson believed the cost of infrastructure should be shared by all taxpayers, with government taking the lead on major projects.
National finance spokeswoman Nicola Willis talks at the MYOB NZME Beyond The Ballot election debate.
Willis, on the other hand, wanted to see the users of infrastructure take more of the load than they currently are by paying tolls, congestion charges or levies if new infrastructure increases the value of their properties.
She supported diversifying the way infrastructure is financed, welcoming more private investment, even if the returns sought by investors were greater than the interest the Government would need to pay to simply debt finance projects itself.
“We’re going to work with major funders to see what would make it stack up for them; what are the revenue mechanisms that would allow them to get it off the ground. And that will vary from project to project,” Willis explained.
“When it comes to rapid transit projects for example – major public transport links in Auckland – it may be that what private financiers are interested in is the development rights to stations to intensify housing around those tracks.”
Robertson had a go at Willis for not having these arrangements firmed up, calling them “mythical” and saying they created a $10 billion gap in National’s transport plan.
“Grant, I’m not going to do commercial negotiations from opposition. That would be dumb,” Willis hit back.
Robertson went on to say, “The certainty that the sector needs comes from the Government being the core of that funding.”
Noting the work that the NZ Super Fund was doing with Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners on a potential offshore windfarm, he said he too was keen to get the private sector more involved.
However, deals would need to be negotiated properly to avoid a repeat of Transmission Gully – a highway built on the back of a public-public-partnership set up under a National-led Government and completed under the current one at a cost of $1.2b – $400 million more than was budgeted for.
“You have a fear of the profit motive and that has held back essential infrastructure investment,” Willis quipped.
On the topic of private investment, Robertson and Willis recommitted to keeping Kiwibank completely Crown-owned and not floating part of it on the stock exchange. This is something ACT would like to do.
Robertson and Willis both acknowledged small businesses’ struggles to get loans from banks, which can be more interested in selling lower-risk mortgages.
Robertson admitted the Government hadn’t managed to get a programme off the ground through which the Government would team up with banks to provide small to medium-sized businesses with equity finance.
At Budget 2022, Robertson allocated $100m towards establishing the independently run investment fund, in which the Crown would have a minority shareholding.
A lot of consultation with the industry has taken place, but the proposal isn’t advancing – at this stage at least.
Willis, on the other hand, highlighted the need for the Commerce Commission to look at the regulatory environment in which banks operate, to ensure this doesn’t hamper competition.
Both Robertson and Willis said their parties would release their fiscal plans this week.
Jenée Tibshraeny is the Herald’s Wellington Business Editor, based in the Parliamentary press gallery. She specialises in government and Reserve Bank policymaking, economics and banking.
